"You don't like DoW?
Interesting.
With Templars, it is very annoying. You are a mêlée army you have to cover much of the board to beat face.
That makes Annihilation hard against someone who has no reason to close with you.
C&C is also frustrating. Joe Foe has his objective all but off the TT and you have to cover 48" to get there, unless he hasn't killed your 2 TROOPS + HQ, which can reduce the distance to 24-42" away.
This makes Seize Ground the only desirable mission for a mêlée army.
With a shooty army, DoW can be good. Very good.
If you deploy first, you push his guys back to within 6" of his edge.
You have gained 6" more than you would with Pitched battle set-up against his initial forces, and 12" more against the rest.
T1: Kroot long shoot they enemy TROOPS [providing they are foot]
The rest of your forces come on.
12" for Fish chassis. 24" for Piranhas [if warranted] 6+d6" for Infantry.
Suits 12+d6"
End of T1, his stuff is in position [12ish" on] and so is yours. Night fight done with.
You have 24+" between you and him, just like if you deployed via Pitched Battle.
As most guys rush-to-crush Tau, one less turn for them to cover the TT.
Not good or good?
If he deploys first, his initial force gets mugged by your whole army,
AND
you come on so you can be in range of his initial force with Suits and Fish chassis but also as far away from the bulk of his subsequent forces.
For example, playing against Templars:
Imagine a clump of Rhinos in the middle.
1] He brings his guys on to the left of them. So you attack his Rhino clump from the right.
The distance between you and his subsequent forces is increased.
2] He brings his guys straight behind them. You can still attack from the right [or left] and the distance [being a triangle] is larger.
or
you can deploy directly in front of the Rhino clump and his subsequent guys will have to drive around their carcasses. Also increasing the distance.
3] He brings his guys on in two parts and on either side of the Rhino clump. He is now as close as he can be to your guys with one part, but quite far away with the other part.
Beautiful! Destroy him in detail!"
If you deploy first, you push his guys back to within 6" of his edge.
You have gained 6" more than you would with Pitched battle set-up against his initial forces, and 12" more against the rest.
T1: Kroot long shoot they enemy TROOPS [providing they are foot]
The rest of your forces come on.
12" for Fish chassis. 24" for Piranhas [if warranted] 6+d6" for Infantry.
Suits 12+d6"
End of T1, his stuff is in position [12ish" on] and so is yours. Night fight done with.
You have 24+" between you and him, just like if you deployed via Pitched Battle.
As most guys rush-to-crush Tau, one less turn for them to cover the TT.
Not good or good?
If he deploys first, his initial force gets mugged by your whole army,
AND
you come on so you can be in range of his initial force with Suits and Fish chassis but also as far away from the bulk of his subsequent forces.
For example, playing against Templars:
Imagine a clump of Rhinos in the middle.
1] He brings his guys on to the left of them. So you attack his Rhino clump from the right.
The distance between you and his subsequent forces is increased.
2] He brings his guys straight behind them. You can still attack from the right [or left] and the distance [being a triangle] is larger.
or
you can deploy directly in front of the Rhino clump and his subsequent guys will have to drive around their carcasses. Also increasing the distance.
3] He brings his guys on in two parts and on either side of the Rhino clump. He is now as close as he can be to your guys with one part, but quite far away with the other part.
Beautiful! Destroy him in detail!"
Wilhelm also brought up some interesting theory on Broadsides, but I will wait to answer that until I get around to the Broadside unit analysis, if you don't mind.
Now for the response out. I'll be re-quoting throughout:
With Templars, it is very annoying. You are a mêlée army you have to cover much of the board to beat face.
That makes Annihilation hard against someone who has no reason to close with you
You note that there is one less turn for the enemy to get to us in Annihilation, meaning problems for assault oriented armies. I will concede that point, but note a necessary side of that; in objectives, there is one less turn for the Tau to weaken the enemy before they have to move on objectives. In an objective game, unfortunately placed objectives can allow assault armies to simply wait in ambush and bear the storm... Fritz's Harlequins come to mind as a perfect example of this, whilst other armies have to survive in different ways, such as reserves, going to ground, etc.
If you deploy first, you push his guys back to within 6" of his edge.
You have gained 6" more than you would with Pitched battle set-up against his initial forces, and 12" more against the rest.
You note that I should push back enemies. This is precisely right, but it comes at the cost of my forward Kroot often enough, and that is too early a death for my comfort. Still, it is how we must play.
You note that I gained area, but also note that due to a lack of ability to shoot, I also lose time. It is a fairly even trade off, but it is not a decision I get to make.
T1: Kroot long shoot they enemy TROOPS [providing they are foot]
The rest of your forces come on.
12" for Fish chassis. 24" for Piranhas [if warranted] 6+d6" for Infantry.
Suits 12+d6"
End of T1, his stuff is in position [12ish" on] and so is yours. Night fight done with.
You have 24+" between you and him, just like if you deployed via Pitched Battle.
As most guys rush-to-crush Tau, one less turn for them to cover the TT.
Not good or good?
Kroot will shoot downfield always if they stay up front... otherwise they fall back.
You are right in stating that the proposed scenario is good, but I still worry about the units that can break it. For example: I often play against Chaos Marines. A Lash Prince can bring the Kroot int assault range and, if he is lucky, lock himself in there. If this happens, I am unable to shoot the beast at my doorstep turn one, and then it can get rid of my second wall. This leaves me in an inferior Mont'ka, with a deadly beast breathing down my neck and another nearby (not to mention the Marines and Oblits on route). This is the worst case scenario, yes, but it is one that Dawn of War allows, and that I sit through many a time.
Overall, Dawn of War screws practically everyone. Shooty armies lose turns of shooting, assaulty armies lose space... I honestly think it is the worst deployment type of them all.
For example, playing against Templars:
Imagine a clump of Rhinos in the middle.
1] He brings his guys on to the left of them. So you attack his Rhino clump from the right.
The distance between you and his subsequent forces is increased.
2] He brings his guys straight behind them. You can still attack from the right [or left] and the distance [being a triangle] is larger.
or
you can deploy directly in front of the Rhino clump and his subsequent guys will have to drive around their carcasses. Also increasing the distance.
3] He brings his guys on in two parts and on either side of the Rhino clump. He is now as close as he can be to your guys with one part, but quite far away with the other part.
Beautiful! Destroy him in detail!"
Well said, and what I attempt. Many a time a Marine player attempting a cascading cover formation against me gets blockaded nearly completely by a wreckage and a Piranha. Making your opponent's footprint work against him is incredibly useful.
